Discussion:
Install z/OS from DVD
(too old to reply)
Beesley, Paul
2018-03-02 11:59:14 UTC
Permalink
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
“Coming soon will be the ability to IPL _and_ install directly from the HMC DVD drive. It'll be a slow as !@$$ but it won't require an installation server somewhere. You'll still need to connect _into_ the system over the network to complete the install (via SSH or VNC) of course. Even that could be avoided if you set up a custom DVD that points to an autoinst.xml file on the DVD itself and use VNC as the installation method. Completely unattended install without a net. :)”

Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?

Regards and thanks
Paul



Atos, Atos Consulting, Worldline and Canopy The Open Cloud Company are trading names used by the Atos group. The following trading entities are registered in England and Wales: Atos IT Services UK Limited (registered number 01245534), Atos Consulting Limited (registered number 04312380), Atos Worldline UK Limited (registered number 08514184) and Canopy The Open Cloud Company Limited (registration number 08011902). The registered office for each is at 4 Triton Square, Regent’s Place, London, NW1 3HG.The VAT No. for each is: GB232327983.

This e-mail and the documents attached are confidential and intended solely for the addressee, and may contain confidential or privileged information. If you receive this e-mail in error, you are not authorised to copy, disclose, use or retain it. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your systems. As emails may be intercepted, amended or lost, they are not secure. Atos therefore can accept no liability for any errors or their content. Although Atos endeavours to maintain a virus-free network, we do not warrant that this transmission is virus-free and can accept no liability for any damages resulting from any virus transmitted. The risks are deemed to be accepted by everyone who communicates with Atos by email.

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Jousma, David
2018-03-02 12:20:58 UTC
Permalink
This is true for Linux on Z. Not for z/OS.

_________________________________________________________________
Dave Jousma
Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President
***@53.com
1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI  49546 MD RSCB2H
p 616.653.8429
f 616.653.2717

-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Beesley, Paul
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2018 7:00 AM
To: IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Install z/OS from DVD

**CAUTION EXTERNAL EMAIL**

**DO NOT open attachments or click on links from unknown senders or unexpected emails**

We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
“Coming soon will be the ability to IPL _and_ install directly from the HMC DVD drive. It'll be a slow as !@$$ but it won't require an installation server somewhere. You'll still need to connect _into_ the system over the network to complete the install (via SSH or VNC) of course. Even that could be avoided if you set up a custom DVD that points to an autoinst.xml file on the DVD itself and use VNC as the installation method. Completely unattended install without a net. :)”

Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?

Regards and thanks
Paul



Atos, Atos Consulting, Worldline and Canopy The Open Cloud Company are trading names used by the Atos group. The following trading entities are registered in England and Wales: Atos IT Services UK Limited (registered number 01245534), Atos Consulting Limited (registered number 04312380), Atos Worldline UK Limited (registered number 08514184) and Canopy The Open Cloud Company Limited (registration number 08011902). The registered office for each is at 4 Triton Square, Regent’s Place, London, NW1 3HG.The VAT No. for each is: GB232327983.

This e-mail and the documents attached are confidential and intended solely for the addressee, and may contain confidential or privileged information. If you receive this e-mail in error, you are not authorised to copy, disclose, use or retain it. Please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your systems. As emails may be intercepted, amended or lost, they are not secure. Atos therefore can accept no liability for any errors or their content. Although Atos endeavours to maintain a virus-free network, we do not warrant that this transmission is virus-free and can accept no liability for any damages resulting from any virus transmitted. The risks are deemed to be accepted by everyone who communicates with Atos by email.

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Doug Fuerst
2018-03-02 14:28:22 UTC
Permalink
I may have a solution, but it may be the same as a customized offering.
Anyone interested can contact me off list.
Doug

Doug Fuerst
Principal Consultant
BK Associates
718.921.2620 (O)
917.572.7364 (C)
***@bkassociates.net



------ Original Message ------
From: "Jousma, David" <***@53.com>
To: IBM-***@listserv.ua.edu
Sent: 02-Mar-18 7:22:11 AM
Subject: Re: Install z/OS from DVD
Post by Jousma, David
This is true for Linux on Z. Not for z/OS.
_________________________________________________________________
Dave Jousma
Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President
1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI 49546 MD RSCB2H
p 616.653.8429
f 616.653.2717
-----Original Message-----
On Behalf Of Beesley, Paul
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2018 7:00 AM
Subject: Install z/OS from DVD
**CAUTION EXTERNAL EMAIL**
**DO NOT open attachments or click on links from unknown senders or unexpected emails**
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to
be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
“Coming soon will be the ability to IPL _and_ install directly from the
installation server somewhere. You'll still need to connect _into_ the
system over the network to complete the install (via SSH or VNC) of
course. Even that could be avoided if you set up a custom DVD that
points to an autoinst.xml file on the DVD itself and use VNC as the
installation method. Completely unattended install without a net. :)”
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
Regards and thanks
Paul
Atos, Atos Consulting, Worldline and Canopy The Open Cloud Company are
trading names used by the Atos group. The following trading entities
are registered in England and Wales: Atos IT Services UK Limited
(registered number 01245534), Atos Consulting Limited (registered
number 04312380), Atos Worldline UK Limited (registered number
08514184) and Canopy The Open Cloud Company Limited (registration
number 08011902). The registered office for each is at 4 Triton Square,
Regent’s Place, London, NW1 3HG.The VAT No. for each is: GB232327983.
This e-mail and the documents attached are confidential and intended
solely for the addressee, and may contain confidential or privileged
information. If you receive this e-mail in error, you are not
authorised to copy, disclose, use or retain it. Please notify the
sender immediately and delete this email from your systems. As emails
may be intercepted, amended or lost, they are not secure. Atos
therefore can accept no liability for any errors or their content.
Although Atos endeavours to maintain a virus-free network, we do not
warrant that this transmission is virus-free and can accept no
liability for any damages resulting from any virus transmitted. The
risks are deemed to be accepted by everyone who communicates with Atos
by email.
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Edward MacNEIL
2018-03-02 15:35:07 UTC
Permalink
 































































































-teD
  Original Message  
From: Doug Fuerst
Sent: Friday, March 2, 2018 09:30
To: IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Reply To: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
Subject: Re: Install z/OS from DVD

I may have a solution, but it may be the same as a customized offering.
Anyone interested can contact me off list.
Doug

Doug Fuerst
Principal Consultant
BK Associates
718.921.2620 (O)
917.572.7364 (C)
***@bkassociates.net



------ Original Message ------
From: "Jousma, David" <***@53.com>
To: IBM-***@listserv.ua.edu
Sent: 02-Mar-18 7:22:11 AM
Subject: Re: Install z/OS from DVD
This is true for Linux on Z. Not for z/OS.
_________________________________________________________________
Dave Jousma
Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President
1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI 49546 MD RSCB2H
p 616.653.8429
f 616.653.2717
-----Original Message-----
On Behalf Of Beesley, Paul
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2018 7:00 AM
Subject: Install z/OS from DVD
**CAUTION EXTERNAL EMAIL**
**DO NOT open attachments or click on links from unknown senders or unexpected emails**
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to
be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
“Coming soon will be the ability to IPL _and_ install directly from the
installation server somewhere. You'll still need to connect _into_ the
system over the network to complete the install (via SSH or VNC) of
course. Even that could be avoided if you set up a custom DVD that
points to an autoinst.xml file on the DVD itself and use VNC as the
installation method. Completely unattended install without a net. :)”
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
Regards and thanks
Paul
Atos, Atos Consulting, Worldline and Canopy The Open Cloud Company are
trading names used by the Atos group. The following trading entities
are registered in England and Wales: Atos IT Services UK Limited
(registered number 01245534), Atos Consulting Limited (registered
number 04312380), Atos Worldline UK Limited (registered number
08514184) and Canopy The Open Cloud Company Limited (registration
number 08011902). The registered office for each is at 4 Triton Square,
Regent’s Place, London, NW1 3HG.The VAT No. for each is: GB232327983.
This e-mail and the documents attached are confidential and intended
solely for the addressee, and may contain confidential or privileged
information. If you receive this e-mail in error, you are not
authorised to copy, disclose, use or retain it. Please notify the
sender immediately and delete this email from your systems. As emails
may be intercepted, amended or lost, they are not secure. Atos
therefore can accept no liability for any errors or their content.
Although Atos endeavours to maintain a virus-free network, we do not
warrant that this transmission is virus-free and can accept no
liability for any damages resulting from any virus transmitted. The
risks are deemed to be accepted by everyone who communicates with Atos
by email.
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Edward MacNEIL
2018-03-02 21:05:06 UTC
Permalink
-teD
  Original Message  
From: Doug Fuerst
Sent: Friday, March 2, 2018 09:30
To: IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Reply To: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
Subject: Re: Install z/OS from DVD

I may have a solution, but. it may be the same as a customized offering.
Anyone interested can contact me off list.
Doug

Doug Fuerst
Principal Consultant
BK Associates
718.921.2620 (O)
917.572.7364 (C)
***@bkassociates.net



------ Original Message ------
From: "Jousma, David" <***@53.com>
To: IBM-***@listserv.ua.edu
Sent: 02-Mar-18 7:22:11 AM
Subject: Re: Install z/OS from DVD
This is true for Linux on Z. Not for z/OS.
_________________________________________________________________
Dave Jousma
Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President
1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI 49546 MD RSCB2H
p 616.653.8429
f 616.653.2717
-----Original Message-----
On Behalf Of Beesley, Paul
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2018 7:00 AM
Subject: Install z/OS from DVD
**CAUTION EXTERNAL EMAIL**
**DO NOT open attachments or click on links from unknown senders or unexpected emails**
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to
be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
“Coming soon will be the ability to IPL _and_ install directly from the
installation server somewhere. You'll still need to connect _into_ the
system over the network to complete the install (via SSH or VNC) of
course. Even that could be avoided if you set up a custom DVD that
points to an autoinst.xml file on the DVD itself and use VNC as the
installation method. Completely unattended install without a net. :)”
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
Regards and thanks
Paul
Atos, Atos Consulting, Worldline and Canopy The Open Cloud Company are
trading names used by the Atos group. The following trading entities
are registered in England and Wales: Atos IT Services UK Limited
(registered number 01245534), Atos Consulting Limited (registered
number 04312380), Atos Worldline UK Limited (registered number
08514184) and Canopy The Open Cloud Company Limited (registration
number 08011902). The registered office for each is at 4 Triton Square,
Regent’s Place, London, NW1 3HG.The VAT No. for each is: GB232327983.
This e-mail and the documents attached are confidential and intended
solely for the addressee, and may contain confidential or privileged
information. If you receive this e-mail in error, you are not
authorised to copy, disclose, use or retain it. Please notify the
sender immediately and delete this email from your systems. As emails
may be intercepted, amended or lost, they are not secure. Atos
therefore can accept no liability for any errors or their content.
Although Atos endeavours to maintain a virus-free network, we do not
warrant that this transmission is virus-free and can accept no
liability for any damages resulting from any virus transmitted. The
risks are deemed to be accepted by everyone who communicates with Atos
by email.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
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John Eells
2018-03-02 15:45:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beesley, Paul
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
<snip>

You will need to use the COD.

Although Linux and z/VM can be IPLed from DVD, z/OS must IPL from
attached (ECKD) DASD. It does not now and will likely not any time soon
support IPLed from anywhere in the HMC file system, including DVD.

Based on that, the DVD-based installation process involves the
Customized Offerings Driver (which we affectionately call the COD).
Standalone DFSMSdss, which can be IPLed from the HMC's DVD drive, was
changed a while back to support restoring disk volumes from DVD files.
The COD z/OS system is restored using DFSMSdss and then IPLed. (You can
optionally use standalone ICKDSF to verify target volume labels and INIT
the volumes before restoring them, but we taught DFSMSdss to be a bit
smarter a while back so this is no longer a required step.)

The restores run reasonably quickly, though I don't have current
numbers. When we first planned this support we thought it would take a
lot longer than it actually does, because we--well, I (blush)--forgot
that we dumped the COD systems with the COMPRESS keyword, which reduces
the HMC-to-DASD data transfer time significantly. If I recall
correctly, the entire process from DFSMSdss IPL to z/OS IPL only takes a
few hours.

In turn, the COD z/OS system supports installing the z/OS you actually
want from direct download to z/OS (if you have connectivity at the site)
or by transferring files from a workstation to the z/OS UNIX file
system, whether they were downloaded or are also on DVD. You can
install a new copy of z/OS using ServerPac (if you are sane) or CBPDO
(if you aren't); the COD supports both.

It might also be possible to use the FTP-based IPL available on z14 and
later HMCs for DFSMSdss and FTP file access for the restores, with the
files on your workstation (set up as an FTP server), which I am told
should work, but which we have not explicitly tested. That might or
might not be faster than restoring from DVD, depending on where the
bottleneck is in the effective data transfer rate. Speaking for myself,
though, restores from DVD would certainly have been done for quite a
while while I was still fiddling with the FTP configuration and physical
connections for this IPL path, but YMMV.
--
John Eells
IBM Poughkeepsie
***@us.ibm.com

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Chris Hoelscher
2018-03-02 15:49:49 UTC
Permalink
COD?? Sounds .... fishy to me (sorry)

Chris Hoelscher
Technology Architect, Database Infrastructure Services
Technology Solution Services
Humana Inc.
123 East Main Street
Louisville, KY 40202
Humana.com
(502) 476-2538 or 407-7266


-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of John Eells
Sent: Friday, March 2, 2018 10:47 AM
To: IBM-***@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Install z/OS from DVD
Post by Beesley, Paul
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
<snip>

You will need to use the COD.

Although Linux and z/VM can be IPLed from DVD, z/OS must IPL from attached (ECKD) DASD. It does not now and will likely not any time soon support IPLed from anywhere in the HMC file system, including DVD.

Based on that, the DVD-based installation process involves the Customized Offerings Driver (which we affectionately call the COD).
Standalone DFSMSdss, which can be IPLed from the HMC's DVD drive, was changed a while back to support restoring disk volumes from DVD files.
The COD z/OS system is restored using DFSMSdss and then IPLed. (You can optionally use standalone ICKDSF to verify target volume labels and INIT the volumes before restoring them, but we taught DFSMSdss to be a bit smarter a while back so this is no longer a required step.)

The restores run reasonably quickly, though I don't have current numbers. When we first planned this support we thought it would take a lot longer than it actually does, because we--well, I (blush)--forgot that we dumped the COD systems with the COMPRESS keyword, which reduces the HMC-to-DASD data transfer time significantly. If I recall correctly, the entire process from DFSMSdss IPL to z/OS IPL only takes a few hours.

In turn, the COD z/OS system supports installing the z/OS you actually want from direct download to z/OS (if you have connectivity at the site) or by transferring files from a workstation to the z/OS UNIX file system, whether they were downloaded or are also on DVD. You can install a new copy of z/OS using ServerPac (if you are sane) or CBPDO (if you aren't); the COD supports both.

It might also be possible to use the FTP-based IPL available on z14 and later HMCs for DFSMSdss and FTP file access for the restores, with the files on your workstation (set up as an FTP server), which I am told should work, but which we have not explicitly tested. That might or might not be faster than restoring from DVD, depending on where the bottleneck is in the effective data transfer rate. Speaking for myself, though, restores from DVD would certainly have been done for quite a while while I was still fiddling with the FTP configuration and physical connections for this IPL path, but YMMV.

--
John Eells
IBM Poughkeepsie
***@us.ibm.com

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Brian Westerman
2018-03-03 06:32:13 UTC
Permalink
Most new site people order the COD.

You can install from USB (or DVD on the older HMCs that still have them), but you still have to eventually IPL z/OS once you load the volumes. The ADCD system is shipped on DVD's for just that purpose as is the academic z/os image. The USB based method is actually just a bunch of .ISO images.

The down side is that it VERY slow. I mean watching paint dry or watching window glass melt kind of slow.

It's actually faster to use the DVD (or the COD tape) to bring up the stand alone dfdss and use real carts.

I also think that someone from Israel had a product a few years back that allowed you to mount network dasd and you could access it from an image or even from the HMC, but I can't remember the name of the product or if it "actually" did that.

Brian
Post by John Eells
Post by Beesley, Paul
We are setting up a z/Next mainframe on a greenfield site and want to be able to install z/OS from a DVD.
Back in 2016, Mark Post said..
Has ‘soon’ arrived yet? Or are we still looking at using a Customised Offering Driver?
<snip>
You will need to use the COD.
Although Linux and z/VM can be IPLed from DVD, z/OS must IPL from
attached (ECKD) DASD. It does not now and will likely not any time soon
support IPLed from anywhere in the HMC file system, including DVD.
Based on that, the DVD-based installation process involves the
Customized Offerings Driver (which we affectionately call the COD).
Standalone DFSMSdss, which can be IPLed from the HMC's DVD drive, was
changed a while back to support restoring disk volumes from DVD files.
The COD z/OS system is restored using DFSMSdss and then IPLed. (You can
optionally use standalone ICKDSF to verify target volume labels and INIT
the volumes before restoring them, but we taught DFSMSdss to be a bit
smarter a while back so this is no longer a required step.)
The restores run reasonably quickly, though I don't have current
numbers. When we first planned this support we thought it would take a
lot longer than it actually does, because we--well, I (blush)--forgot
that we dumped the COD systems with the COMPRESS keyword, which reduces
the HMC-to-DASD data transfer time significantly. If I recall
correctly, the entire process from DFSMSdss IPL to z/OS IPL only takes a
few hours.
In turn, the COD z/OS system supports installing the z/OS you actually
want from direct download to z/OS (if you have connectivity at the site)
or by transferring files from a workstation to the z/OS UNIX file
system, whether they were downloaded or are also on DVD. You can
install a new copy of z/OS using ServerPac (if you are sane) or CBPDO
(if you aren't); the COD supports both.
It might also be possible to use the FTP-based IPL available on z14 and
later HMCs for DFSMSdss and FTP file access for the restores, with the
files on your workstation (set up as an FTP server), which I am told
should work, but which we have not explicitly tested. That might or
might not be faster than restoring from DVD, depending on where the
bottleneck is in the effective data transfer rate. Speaking for myself,
though, restores from DVD would certainly have been done for quite a
while while I was still fiddling with the FTP configuration and physical
connections for this IPL path, but YMMV.
--
John Eells
IBM Poughkeepsie
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Timothy Sipples
2018-03-05 01:44:19 UTC
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John mentioned the Customized Offerings Driver (COD), which is the
preferred method to start from DVD in order to install and start z/OS.

For the record, there are a couple other technically viable ways to get the
job done, assuming you have an IPLable z/OS volume (or the Customized
Offerings Driver itself) on hand:

1. You could IPL licensed z/VM from its DVD, use z/VM DDR to restore the
ECKD z/OS volume(s) (after installing z/VM perhaps), then IPL z/OS. Backup
and Restore Manager for z/VM can also restore ECKD volumes.

2. You could IPL Linux from DVD, use Linux to restore the ECKD z/OS volume
(s), then IPL z/OS. The Linux kernel added "raw-track access mode" circa
2013 that provides the necessary ECKD volume support for these purposes.
(Maybe this was the feature Mark Post was referring to?)

Of course, you could physically (re)attach your storage device containing
your IPLable z/OS volume. Ordinarily your storage device is physically
large and not designed to move from place to place every day, but I notice
that Visara markets FICON-attached ECKD storage in a 2U rack mount size:
their Vi-8810L model. A 2U sized storage unit is fairly practical to wheel
around your data center -- or even between data centers if you ship it in a
well padded case. True, it's still physically larger and heavier than a
DVD. According to the specification sheet, the Visara Vi-8810L supports
FICON 4, 8, and 16 Gb/s.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy Sipples
IT Architect Executive, Industry Solutions, IBM Z & LinuxONE,
Multi-Geography
E-Mail: ***@sg.ibm.com

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